Dad Brain, Mentorship, and Mindfulness: Life's Changes Need Active Adaptation

[music] I hear a lot of stuff. I was like, you know, my I went for a >> I went for a haircut in Seattle when we were there and then right there's a Vietnamese lady that was cutting my hair and she's like, "You're you're going a little bald right there." [laughter] >> Really? >> She was like, "You don't need a haircut. You don't want to lose it." >> I'm like, "Really? I thought I had good hair.

I didn't think I was losing hair." But then >> I got a little paranoid and every single like little uh >> um thing makes me think I'm losing my hair. So I started researching and uh looking at different things that I can buy possibly for hair loss, prevent hair loss and >> right >> I was looking at finasteride and then the the side effects the finestide can have and then minoxidilonazol. >> Next you're going to be injecting some PRP into your head.

[laughter] >> PRP but I was like you know I'm not that bad. I mean I still have pretty full set of hair. Uh but I think uh for someone starting out I mean uh just a topical minoxidil is not a bad idea. I haven't I haven't used it yet, but I've started looking it on Amazon. >> Right. Right. >> And then I started getting a bunch of him and her ads. [laughter] >> It's a natural progression. >> So, I started getting those ads for him and they have their own hair hair loss product line, you know?

>> Right. Right. >> Now, my Instagram feed is uh just a bunch of hair loss stuff. >> Dude, I know. If you book a flight to Turkey, we know what's happening. >> Yeah. I mean, I don't I think I'm still far away from that. I mean, I I don't think I'm losing hair that badly, but uh you know, uh it's something you got to deal with when you start approaching your 40s. I'm still dude far away from that, but it's happening, right? >> I know. I think I'm I'm good right now, but you never know.

>> You never know. >> You're you're hiding hiding it behind the long hair, dude. Sometimes, you know, it happens. Uh you you have all the hair and then and then all of a sudden there's a bald spot right there and then you start >> It just shows up, huh? >> It just shows up. >> Yeah. told I told Samia, my my wife, Sammy, I if I start going bald, I'm just going to shave my whole head. >> I'm going to go with the the Vin Diesel look. >> I'm just going to shave the whole head.

That's probably, you know, the the hardcore look, you know, looking like you're you've been through stuff. And I have a big scar on my on the back of my head, too. So, >> uh it's going to make it >> battle scars, bro. >> Battle scars. Yeah, man. I mean, that's what uh you know, uh being a dad does to you. the stress of being a dad, >> right?

[laughter] >> Your practice, uh, you know, uh, and now I think I'm, you know, >> you start start focusing on your health at some point when life slows down a little bit, but seems to never slow down when you have when you have young kids. >> U, it's just non-stop. >> Yeah, exactly. But I mean, there's a recent study, right, that we were both looking at.

shows that dads go through a big brain uh change in their brains in the first uh first eight months or you know first especially the first eight weeks 12 weeks of the the kids life >> right and the there's a change in the gray matter and uh especially the cortex and that's where a lot of the bonding and understanding other people's emotions and empathy happens. Um there's a big hormonal change as well in dad's uh when babies are born. You know there was a thing called mom brain is real.

You know moms go through huge huge huge hormonal changes. I mean producing pro prolactin and oxytocin but dads go through changes too. I mean they have a decrease in testosterone levels. They they also get prolactin and oxytocin and it kind of helps them bond with the baby as well you know. Big change. >> Totally. Yeah. And like I mean we're not even pretending to equate the two.

I mean, like moms go through way more and it lasts way longer and I mean, changes in their body, changes in their brain, but you know, the the quote unquote dad brain like you're talking about, there are real changes in like the actual anatomy, the structure of the brain changes when you're a new father. And the the most interesting thing I found from that paper was yeah, I mean, there's a about a 1% gray matter reduction.

It does affect the areas that trigger emotion and emotional bonding, the hormonal changes. But what I thought was most interesting is like the more present you are, the more in that study that the dads were around the kids and the more time they spent in that first 6 to 8 weeks actually very strongly correlated with the amount of reduction seen in those specific areas. It's almost like a dose dependent, right?

Like if you took time off, if you actually were around your children and your wife in that first early phase and you actually actively parttook in the bonding that almost seemingly like triggered the brain changes. Um almost like taking an active role in being a dad, not just okay, child occurred, I'm going to continue my life now. There's just one more human at the house. You know what I mean? >> Yeah. Yeah. So it's it's interesting. They they took 25 firsttime dads, right?

And they did brain imaging and brain scans at uh three months, six months, nine months, 12, oh sorry, n three, three weeks, six weeks, nine weeks, 12 weeks, and then at 24 weeks. And they saw the changes and they saw changes in the dads that were the most involved uh and most present had the most amount of changes that >> uh improved their empathy, their bonding with the kid. So it just showed you that it doesn't you don't have those dad changes and dad brain just for having a kid.

You have those changes when you show up for your kid. >> Yeah. And it makes you think, right? Like [clears throat] if those changes are most pronounced and they kind of leveled off, you know, they were most pronounced in like the first 6 to8 weeks and then they tapered and like you said, it was the dads who were really involved early on had the biggest changes.

That could be something that's like lasting for life in a way that if you invested the time, energy, and desire to bond with your child early early on. They're a new really new infant and developed that like change in the brain that triggers higher emotional connection, ability to read emotions and other people. It could be something that lasts for the lifetime, you know, your remaining life and your remaining interactions with your kid as a father.

And it may, I mean, this is I'm going out on a limb. I'm not saying that the study stated this, but it could potentially lead to a continued high level of bonding and emotional connection and relationship with your kids for the rest of your life just by investing that time early on. >> Yeah. You know, >> I mean neuroplasticity, everyone talks about that's a real thing where brain can actively change by the things you do, right?

Uh if you are someone that's curious, that's someone who's constantly reading about things and learning new things and reading books, gaining knowledge, your brain changes. It matures, it becomes um you know creates new synapses and and connections where you can you can you can you become wise and you know there's there's wisdom to it, right? Spending that time doing that work. Same with having a baby. Um it's not going to automatically change.

You have to have those moments of you know uh uh closeness with the baby, put them to sleep, cuddling with them.

uh the dad's body also produces uh you know prolactin and oxytocin and the testosterone levels go down and uh because you you are spending that time with the baby and that's uh and these brain changes definitely uh you know can be permanent have a long-lasting effect and that kind of makes a case for you know dad's being there early on I mean paternity leave is not as as um common now it is getting more uh accepted and you know expected to uh for everyone but back in the day it used to be right I mean there was always there's this thing that millennial dads are uh more present more more involved with their kids there they have a better relationship better bond but is that the millennial millennial dads or the world we're living in is a world of abundance where we have certain luxuries in life where most millennial dads are able to take some time off to spend time with their kids where maybe in the 1950s the 1960s7s maybe the dads at that time could not do that and maybe they never developed that bond early on in life and they just did not have that kind of those brain changes that you see it's just assumption I'm not saying that's what happened >> idea that hey is it is it truly is it something special about these younger dads nowadays or is it because they were able to spend that time early on with their kids >> yeah it's a good question man I don't know I mean regardless of the reason I think it's great I mean I I loved the paternity time I took off and you know like with my son my first kid um with Ran I I really didn't take much time.

I mean like barely two weeks I was in training. I was in fellowship wasn't much time at all and I feel like I missed out on a lot of that stuff you know like Tommy would text me like look what he's doing today or like a little video or something. I was like yeah damn like I I should be there. not like trying to do another shoulder replacement, you know, but like with Sophia, it was great because it took like a full three months and you know, you're there all day every day for all of it.

It was it was very different. Um, and it really hit me then, you know, like I thought with Rayan that, oh, I'm getting the updates, Sami's telling me what happened. I'll come home, play with him, hold them. She would tell me all about the day and everything.

But like when I saw it in person and I was partaking in it, I was holding Sophia, feeding her during the day with the bottle, you know, just like messing with her, putting her to sleep, that's when I was like, man, I kind of like missed a lot of this with Brian in his first few months of life. And there's just it's just how it was. Like you didn't have 3 months during your fellowship training to take off. You just got what you got. >> Yeah.

with you know it's funny with Aslan the first time we had um our first son um I was I was in cardiology fellowship so I took two weeks off and then my my program put me on an easier rotation they knew that you know I was about to have a baby so I was on an echo rotation where I was just treating echoes and would be home on time so got it was still busy it was still busy like you know I was still like you know 7 to 5 5:30 sometimes later but I would be home in the evenings and kind of spend time but my surgery happened right uh for you know at that time I got um >> right >> diagnosed with with um with with the condition I had and I had the spinal surgery uh for the tumor removal um and then I got to spend around six to eight weeks at home every day with him you know that was kind of >> your your recovery was your forced paternity leave >> yeah my recovery was my forced paternity leave so I got to do a lot of that a lot of bonding early on in his life when he was you know much younger and that created a bond.

I mean, I would wake up and be with him and we lived in a small apartment at that time cuz I was training. So, >> we'd spend a lot of time. I was part of a lot of the a lot of uh you know those moments early on. So, it happened right when I was born. Yeah. >> I mean, you you had uh you had the gray matter reduction twice. I only had it the second time. [laughter] >> Yeah. Yeah. A forced gray matter reduction, too. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah.

So that that kind of helped me kind of have a force fraternity. It was stressful time at that time, but looking back now, I got to spend some quality time with him. And now that my um time is more in my control, like you know, I did um on the second baby time, I I did scale back a little bit on my duties. I I changed the timings of my clinic. I was able to uh you know, go to the hospital less, do less procedures, punt a lot of the things to other doctors.

uh um you know and which they were happy to take you know cuz private is how it works. >> Um so I scaled back quite a bit bit and was able to spend a lot more time with her in her early days and kind of bond and be there. Now my life's gotten back busy again. So I'm not spending as much time by the time I get home. Sometimes she's it's ready for her bath time and you know it's uh bedtime and at least those are the times I'm able to spend with them not at least do the bath time and bedtime.

It's tough but um you know it's important it's important for dads to show up be there. It it does create that lasting bond. And I don't I don't Most dads looking back no one says oh man I wish I worked more. You know, everyone everyone everyone says, "Oh, I wish I spent more time with my kids." Uh, not that I work unless you were just lazy and not doing anything and just at home uh playing video games and smoking all day, then yeah, you should wish >> video games and smoking.

[laughter] >> I mean, there are there are people like that. That's that that's most [laughter] >> I mean, can you imagine? It just sounds so funny. Like [snorts] you're at work, you come home, you're like, "Man, I'm tired. I'm just going to go put on some Grand Theft Auto and smoke some weed. And it's like, what about your two kids that are in middle school and your wife is there and just No, I'm just going to play some games and smoke. [laughter] >> Yeah.

>> But I guess you I mean, some people do that. I just think it's hilarious. >> Yeah. I mean, you know, it's shown time and time again that presence of both parents, uh, you know, plays a huge role in how kids develop, right?

them getting two different set of adults that's raising them um you know different personalities different qualities it brings a it brings a different dynamic in the family and that family dinner time uh dad being there mom being there um you know kind of mom giving her input dad giving their input their own you know according to their own personalities shapes the kid the kids that's all they learn I mean sometimes I see a line do stuff and I'm like dude that's what I Okay, it was other other day uh [laughter] we were we were driving and uh you know uh we're kind of stuck in traffic and all I hear in the back is like, "God, so much traffic.

[laughter] >> Why did you hear this?" >> Yeah. Did they copy all of our stuff? >> Yeah. Because he was like, "God, so much traffic." >> Yeah. >> Yeah. this Fourth of July, we were hanging out with a bunch of friends and we were just shooting fireworks in their driveway and like Rayan started getting excited and he just like yelled, "Oh yeah, baby." And everyone just stopped and looked at me. You're like, "Did you teach him that?" I was like, "Well, not intentionally.

I just said it and you know, he picked it up. [laughter] It was just so funny." >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Which you're totally right. Like parents being present and like that. I think that's like a very important distinction of like you're not just there in the same house or in the same room. You're actually present. Like you're putting your damn phone away. You know, you're interacting with your kid. Like get off the phone, get off the laptop, whatever you're doing.

Like actually be engaged with your child. Play with them. Like sit on the floor and play with their Legos with them. Or they want to run around with like, you know, like Ron loves pretending to be like Ninja Turtles, right? He's like into that right now. So he's got like the little ninja turtle bandanas and different colored ones, you know.

So he'll ask me to wear one and he'll wear one and you know he'll give me like a fake little nunchuk and he'll hold the little daggers and we'll run around and you know like just do I love doing that you know I just put my phone away and I like a lot of people do and I think it's great because if you don't do that and your child is kind of like fighting for your attention versus the device it creates a very weird dynamic and that they're kind of like left of their own devices.

I mean, I think being engaged is how you really develop that relationship and keep it going as they get older. >> Yeah, for sure. And that's a bad habit that a lot of people need to uh push away, including me sometimes. You know, sometimes I get home and there's a bunch of emails to answer from work and bunch of messages and to catch up on. And I haven't gotten a chance to do that during work.

So sometimes I'm just like on my phone like replying to messages, replying to emails and uh and then you know um I get I get called out multiple times. Hey, get off your phone. Get off your phone. [laughter] So it's a bad habit sometimes. You know, work consumes you. And you know it's you have to learn how to like put put some of the work away and um kind of get off the phone um and create strict boundaries uh to be present. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's a it's a interest.

There's a there's a few devices that they built too now where it's called it's called the brick where you can install that in your in your house and it deactivates all your phones uh until you you set a you can set a timer and as soon as you enter the zone close to it uh your phone can be deactivated or or completely shut down and then once you move away from the zone so it's an interesting thing.

Some people need discipline where they they just can't do it themselves and they they need to be forced in those things. I think I think it's an important thing to do. Sometimes for especially for physicians who deal with emergencies, having your phone around is important, especially if you have your own business and um need to know about employees not coming in the next day or or some kind of other fire that's burning somewhere, your phone is the key to that blind side.

So, it does it does take a toll on you. uh you know and that's kind of the the next topic that uh we're talking about about you know uh physicians owning their own practice and how is that still possible? Um you know for me uh I'd say yes it's definitely still possible.

I mean you know I I did it uh and four years ago when I was starting it was very it seemed very impossible you know even in my fellowship people um used to when they heard that I was doing that right out of training they used to be like oh like how you going to do that um you know and people would say yeah yeah it wasn't until very late I mean you know I was I was uh up till my almost December before right before I graduated I was looking for jobs I was applying to different things I sent out resumes.

I met with a few people and then um yeah, six, seven months away from GRA. >> Yeah. I mean, I I interviewed at like, you know, Houston Methodist. I interviewed at some other private practices as well. And I I met with another guy and he's a very nice guy. He's a cardiologist. Um and he was at that time looking for another partner to join him. And you know, he had a solo practice. And you know, I looked at that. I was like, you know, this guy's doing it. You know, he's doing it.

he's he's has a solo cardiology practice. Um I knew I wanted to continue to stay involved in our clinical trial business and the only way to stay involved would be if I was somewhat independent and and in private practice. So I was like you know he's he's doing it why can't I I do it. So it's around the December November December right before uh I graduated you know maybe five or six months before I was like okay maybe I should kind of attempt to start my own practice. It's doable seems like.

And then uh there's another uh older cardiologist, you know, he's uh he he's worked closely with us in the past. Uh um I met with for coffee with him. Uh and he said, you know, the best advice I can give you is just start your own practice, be your own boss. Um then I met with a few other doctors in family. You know, in family you have a bunch of doctors and you know, they they they're practicing and everyone kept saying the same thing.

He's like, "Hey, the best thing you can do for yourself is start your practice." And everyone was encouraging at that time. But the problem was um everyone in in an academic practice that I I talked to through my residency through fellowship, no one ever thought it was possible. No one ever encouraged that. No one truly probably even knew how to do that, you know, cuz they've never done it. So there was never any encouragement from there.

But some of the community doctors that I talked to, uh family, friends, um you know, this older cardiologist, Dr.

doctor um and then there's another electrophysiologist who was also kind of I got in touch with and he also encouraged me uh and then I was like you know maybe it is doable um so then I decided to just kind of pull the you know yeah mentorship you know back in the day uh ear in the early 14th 15th 16th century even up to the 18th century like that's how most people started their careers right they started with mentorship like they they were they were they were in school and then they became apprentice and they would under work under someone's apprenticeship for many years and put in hours and hours and then they would go on their own.

Um there's a very good book by Robert Green called Mastery. Uh and in that book he talks about uh putting in 10,000 hours under apprenticeship and finding the right uh mentors. uh and he he talks in detail about the mentor mentee relationship, how you should seek mentors um in fields that you find interesting. Um learn from them, absorb from them, never outshine them.

Um work u you know always be there to help their work and and make sure you're there to facilitate what they're trying to accomplish. But at some point when you realize that you know you've kind of outgrown them and you've kind of know when to cut them off and move on and kind of create your own independent path as well right those those things are important.

uh finding the right mentor, seeking guidance, but also not just uh anchoring on one set of guidance, getting getting views from many different people, right? A lot of people trust someone, they get their guidance, but that person has that one lens, one narrow lens of what they've their lived experiences, right? They only know what they've done, what they've lived, and I mean, I'm guilty of that. I give advice based on my lived experiences, right?

Um but talking to other people u multiple people networking u being interested and curious about their life and their career path and then uh the other thing I would say reading books uh as well and that's another form of mentorship that we don't think about but these are people that have gone through certain life experiences and now they're writing their life experiences in a book which you can you can read and learn from.

So, so those are the kind of mentorship people should seek and kind of go on and create their own path. And most physicians unfortunately get in stuck in this this mindset where they're they go into medical school where they're around academic physicians. They go into residency where most of the physicians they're working for are hospital um you know hospital employed physicians or academic physicians. Then they go into fellowship.

So the mentorship model for physicians does not expose them to private practice physicians who are entrepreneurs who are doing their thing and that kind of limits them and most uh physicians I feel don't seek those kind of mentors outside they don't even think about that they some there's the idea of looking down upon private practice physicians I think I did the same thing when I was in when I was in uh training where I looked down upon oh I was like oh that's some guy in private practice but you know I'm in the academic institution and that's kind of seemed more prestigious just but um that's I think that's a downside.

>> Yeah. But you know being being a being a dad, someone who values the family time and family family life there there couldn't be a better decision than going into private practice, right? The autonomy it provides you uh ability to take you on vacations, block out the time you need. I mean, randomly on a random Tuesday, I block off time when Aslan has a a music recital for his, you know, class and I at 10:00 a.m. I just go and, you know, go watch that.

Or if he has some kind of little karate belt graduation at at 2:00 p.m. in the afternoon, I block off my clinic time and I go, you know, my time is my time. I I choose when to work, when to not to work. And that's what a lot of physicians are losing. You know as you as you know uh we've talked about private equity and then one thing we never talk about is hospital owned practices and hospital hospitals own majority of the practices out there.

Majority of the physicians are uh hospital employed physicians or their private equity. >> Yeah it's not the lion share but I think the the concern has been the rate that it's growing at. Right.

it was like from 1% to 2% to 6% at a very fast rate in the past in the past uh few years but hospitals still show and and physician owned practices in in a matter of 10 years went from 60% physician owned to around 40% physician owned which is and there's a slow erosion of our ownership our stake into in our own profession right I mean law firms are mostly owned by lawyers uh you know even in dentistry dentists are much more entre entrepreneurial and they have a lot of more ownership of their own practices.

What happens in in in physician owned practices is uh you know the physician does not stay at the top and there was an interesting thing that I was reading in one of the books I was reading is you know in every organization the top node is always answerable to someone right in large organization the top the top per the person at the top is answerable to the shareholders the board right just like that in a physician practices at the top is a physician and the only person the physician is answerable to after that is is the patient itself, right?

The physician the the physician is face to face with the physician with the patient and they're answerable to the the patient. Uh in a hospital owned system or a private equity owned system, the person at the top is never answerable to the patient. They're answerable to the the the bottom line. They're not face to face with the phys with the patient. They're not answering to the physi the patient. The physician is the physician is not the person at the top in this situation.

the physician is somewhere in the middle and they're the ones facing the patient. But that's what makes a big difference because when the the patient is fa face to face with the pat the physician, they can have those that one-on-one conversation. You have certain connection and empathy towards the patient that you say that hey, you know, uh I I'm treating you.

There could be slight uh you could have profits and and the bottom line in the back of your mind, but you'll always know to do right by the patient. Whereas in in in private equity or hospital owned practices that's completely disconnected. The the patient is no longer uh there at the top. And that changes all and as a physician you have to answer to them, right? You have to answer to them why why your visit time is longer or why your your revenue generation is low. You answer to them.

In a physician practice, you answer to the patient why the service was provided a certain way because you're at the top at that time. So they never get to face that they're shielded from that. Uh and physician who's who is patient facing does not have that kind of motivation anymore you know to to have to provide the right kind of service because you know they they're they have different incentives.

I mean most physicians have a good heart and they want to do right by the patient but some somewhere that game that equation changes when when you're not directly at the top. And I think that the physician in my opinion the best care is provided and the physicians are in charge and that's how it should be. And at some point we'll have to we'll have to go back to a point where physicians are always in leadership positions and that's what I'm always a proponent of. >> Yeah.

But but in in in a private practice model um you don't have that shield of the big institution when you know that in a big institution no matter what happens and however you do maybe if a patient has a bad in bad interaction with with you or multiple bad interactions your patient flow will keep coming. Whereas in a private practice, you're not as well shielded and your reputation. How you treat patients uh your outcomes uh have a much higher uh weight, right?

Your reputation can you you get a bunch of bad reviews and no one would come. Whereas in the hospital system, your patients are being funneled through different avenues. Over here, you're answering answerable to the PCPs that you're going out for referrals for. you're you're you're answerable to uh your staff why the the practice is not picking up the way it's supposed to and you're answerable to the patients of why you are running the practice like you are.

So there's a lot more weight in a bad outcome and you care more about how you are conducting yourself and there's more checks and balances I feel versus an employed model where yeah you your incentives are the same but the downside is much low you know the the floor is much higher where your fall may not be as bad because you miss miss still keep seeing that flow of patient one guy leaves the practice you take on their load the other guy you know is off for the week. So you see their patients.

So somehow your numbers will keep growing. But in private practice, if you do a bad job and you're not keeping up, your your numbers will go down and you'll have to shut down your business. >> Yeah. Yeah. For sure. And you know that kind of you know uh I talk about the the benefits of um private practice where the autonomy, the ability to make your own decisions, being a being able to control your schedule. Yeah. That that comes in.

The downside is the constant paranoia about making sure your practice continues to excel and and continues to provide quality treatment. Your employees are are are performing well and according to the values that you've said and you know your practice doesn't um fall down, get a bad review or do something that could hurt it, right? The constant paranoia as a stress. So, you're pretty much trading one stress for another stress. You're shifting the stresses.

You're not completely getting rid of the stress. I think anything that's hard will have its stress. Uh going from a employed model to a private practice model where you're the practice owner. It goes from less autonomy uh to more autonomy but also uh you know more accountability as well. Uh which which so yeah you you just trade one headache for another. there always will be a headache and to to uh you know uh it weighs in on your health and your longevity as well.

You know maybe that's why I'm losing some of the hair as well because the stresses that come with the practice. >> Yeah.

[laughter] But uh that that brings us to our last topic where you know I always thought of saunas and um you know uh at the gym kind of like a hack and used to think that you know that's just something you know you go in there to just relax but there's actually true longevity benefits with it right I mean there's been some interesting studies that have shown that you know um sauna use with exercise or after exercise can have some pretty damn good benefits. Yeah.

And it was interesting to see that it was exercise versus exercise plus sauna. And exercise plus sauna had uh a little bit more um a lot more benefits with the plasma volume and the heat shock proteins and and and and those effects as well. So you know it's not just exercise. So when you go and exercise it it may be worth it to kind of sit back and spend a little bit 10 to 15 minutes more in the sauna.

The other study was a Swedish study with with sorry with the Finnish study with Finnish spas and what they did was in in Finland they had they they did four to six sessions a week and that showed a reduction in the blood pressure even in cholesterol levels and in cardiovascular outcomes as well. There's a slight decline in mace as well and that's kind of interesting.

I mean you know people um doing four to six week four to six times a week of of sauna therapy along with exercise uh had you know it's a lot yes I mean uh as dads and as practicing physicians I mean I don't know where the time is but it just if you if you do work out four times a week I mean you know spending the extra 10 to 15 minutes in sauna might be completely worth it right I mean it does take the time it is idle time as well where you're just sitting there and just thinking Right.

For mental health as well is there's very few times you get to just sit there and think about things and you know it might be not even worth it to take out your phone and doom scroll because it's just a sauna and you can't really see as well and the phone gets wet. So it might be just worth there to just be there and meditate and just think about your day. Yeah. Yeah. You know it's it's it's it's we're not as mindful anymore. You know mindfulness has kind of died quite a bit.

There's no time for just empty space for just to think about things and and and reflect and you know people used to write diaries and sit there in the quiet and reflect uh uh but now there's no time and that has to do that probably has to have an effect on our brain and and the way the brain is is u you know changes as well because uh having that quiet time having the reflective time has has a lot of benefits right you get to the some of the the the most interesting ideas I have is when there's nothing going on.

I'm just maybe in a shower or just driving and I'm just thinking about things. That's when I get most of the interesting ideas about what I want to do. Uh and unfortunately, we don't let our mind wander anymore.

Um and that's something we we really need to and any successful person that you talk listen to or talk to um anyone that's that has a little bit of time they're highly successful they all meditate you know meditation some kind of meditation um has has huge benefit yeah they're not just there there's yeah and the best kind of meditation is when you just let your mind wander and just think on its own and not directed in some way [snorts] you know you just go about your day and then you see someone and you see them talking but don't make a judgment don't think about anything don't don't don't don't create conclusions just just observe right uh and if you just let that happen on autopilot sometime it takes you to interesting places uh uh but unfortunately most of us don't get to do that much and I think that's a good practice to be in the car I just those are the times where I get to listen to some of the stuff and very few times so I I do listen to a lot of the podcast and and audiobooks during that drive but you know yeah well except Two dogs, one mic.

You got to listen to it while you're driving. Huh? No, I'm talking about everyone else. Yeah. Yeah. Not in the car. The the the the hundred uh the the 15 of you that regularly listen. Continue listening, please. Yeah.